Speeding in My Apartment Complex

[Polaris573]

On Wednesday last week I was confronted by a cop on a golf cart when I got out of my car. As he pulled up I smiled and waved at him and he abruptly said, "YOU NEED TO SLOW DOWN". Quite shocked because I was driving <20 mph I said rather curtly, "No I was doing the speed limit, which is 25 mph in unmarked residential zones and I was doing less than that." He said nothing and puttered over to the other side of the street to glare at me. I thought the matter was over, but I was wrong.

On Friday I got a call from my landlord which I will attach because it's funny and a rather tasteless first warning. It was very unprofessional and spineless for the officer to route his threat to ticket me through the manager of the complex.

I've set up an appointment with the officer and the manager on monday to discuss the matter. Can anyone think of other legal resources I should check before the meeting? I plan to hit them like a ton of bricks for trying to push me around.

I've yet to find out what they think the speed limit is since it's not posted. I've looked all over the place in my lease, at state law, county law, and little rock ordinances. The only specified speed limit I can find is 30 mph in urban districts. There are broad stipulations for driving too fast for conditions, but I think we all know driving 15-20 on an unmarked residential road would be thrown out of court. Especially since state law specifically states that the officer's department needs express permission to enforce traffic code on private property. I've printed all of this out and will be bringing it with me.

Interestingly my lease says complex rules must be in written from to be enforceable so it looks like neither of them them have a leg to stand on.

[DanTheBanjoman]

How is your landlord even a relevant party in this crime?

[DaMulta]

Think of the kids that can pop out of no-where cause they be little people still.

So the fuck down in those areas.

Also seeing you are on private property I would guess what ever your landlord said will be enforced. Seeing your in your car operating it in a public place, but your also on his property what he says goes posted or not posted.

[DanTheBanjoman]

Originally Posted by DaMulta

Think of the kids that can pop out of no-where cause they be little people still.

So the fuck down in those areas.

Also seeing you are on private property I would guess what ever your landlord said will be enforced. Seeing your in your car operating it in a public place, but your also on his property what he says goes posted or not posted.

Nah, it's called natural selection. Kids who cross streets without looking are removed from our evolutionary chain. It's how the lord designed it all.

[twilyth]

I don't know about your state, but here, I don't think an off-duty officer can issue a ticket. What I'm sure of is that they have no power outside of their jurisdiction. So if they're a cop in town A they can't issue a ticket in town B. Some cops, like state police, have statewide jurisdiction, but again, I don't think even they can issue a traffic summons while off duty.

If I'm right about that, then they would be treated like a private citizen, which would mean the most they could do is file a complaint with the municipality. Here in NJ, that means they have to prosecute the complaint themselves, the town's prosecutor won't do it for you.

But these things can vary a lot from state to state, so I'm not sure what to tell you. Personally I think it's an empty threat, but you shouldn't assume anything.

There's also the matter of how they would prove you were speeding. Well, first, as you noted, there would have to be some way of informing you of the limit. Barring that, the only thing the cop could claim is that you were driving carelessly given the circumstances. That's a lot more subjective and I don't know what they would need for something like that. I would hope they need more than the cop's opinion.

[Jetster]

Originally Posted by twilyth

I don't know about your state, but here, I don't think an off-duty officer can issue a ticket. What I'm sure of is that they have no power outside of their jurisdiction. So if they're a cop in town A they can't issue a ticket in town B. Some cops, like state police, have statewide jurisdiction, but again, I don't think even they can issue a traffic summons while off duty.

If I'm right about that, then they would be treated like a private citizen, which would mean the most they could do is file a complaint with the municipality. Here in NJ, that means they have to prosecute the complaint themselves, the town's prosecutor won't do it for you.

But these things can vary a lot from state to state, so I'm not sure what to tell you. Personally I think it's an empty threat, but you shouldn't assume anything.

There's also the matter of how they would prove you were speeding. Well, first, as you noted, there would have to be some way of informing you of the limit. Barring that, the only thing the cop could claim is that you were driving carelessly given the circumstances. That's a lot more subjective and I don't know what they would need for something like that. I would hope they need more than the cop's opinion.

It sounds like its private property. The speed limit is what they say it is. Your first clue is the letter from your landlord referring to a "courtesy Officer" So slow down or pay the price. Or move... Your not the first idiot they have dealt with

[razaron]

I read "Speeding in My..." And thought the thread title was going to be "Speeding in My Pants".
Word.

[twilyth]

Originally Posted by Jetster

It sounds like its private property. The speed limit is what they say it is. Your first clue is the letter from your landlord referring to a "courtesy Officer" So slow down or pay the price. Or move... Your not the first idiot they have dealt with

If it's private property, then they can't issue a speeding violation unless his state somehow can impose state traffic laws on what people do on their own property. Maybe that's possible, but I would want to know what the legal basis for that is before I would believe it.

[Magibeg]

Originally Posted by twilyth

If it's private property, then they can't issue a speeding violation unless his state somehow can impose state traffic laws on what people do on their own property. Maybe that's possible, but I would want to know what the legal basis for that is before I would believe it.

Yea, i don't know in the US but i know in Canada if you're on private property traffic laws don't apply. Stop signs in a mall parking lot are 'technically' optional and you could be whipping around going 100 and if a cop sees you he can't do anything.

[Polaris573]

Originally Posted by DanTheBanjoman

How is your landlord even a relevant party in this crime?

because the cop is spineless and unprofessional and instead of issuing me a stern warning to my face he tucked tail and ran to her.

[theJesus]

Sounds like you're handling it the same way I would try to handle it. When you talk to them, kill 'em with kindness

Originally Posted by Polaris573

because the cop is spineless and unprofessional and instead of issuing me a stern warning to my face he tucked tail and ran to her.

I was assuming the landlord was male until I read this.

[palo]

If you were driving under 20 mph, just put them back in their place.

Don't take no shit from clueless people who happen to have a little power and think they can use it with little discernment.

[JC316]

Originally Posted by twilyth

I don't know about your state, but here, I don't think an off-duty officer can issue a ticket. What I'm sure of is that they have no power outside of their jurisdiction. So if they're a cop in town A they can't issue a ticket in town B. Some cops, like state police, have statewide jurisdiction, but again, I don't think even they can issue a traffic summons while off duty.

If I'm right about that, then they would be treated like a private citizen, which would mean the most they could do is file a complaint with the municipality. Here in NJ, that means they have to prosecute the complaint themselves, the town's prosecutor won't do it for you.

But these things can vary a lot from state to state, so I'm not sure what to tell you. Personally I think it's an empty threat, but you shouldn't assume anything.

There's also the matter of how they would prove you were speeding. Well, first, as you noted, there would have to be some way of informing you of the limit. Barring that, the only thing the cop could claim is that you were driving carelessly given the circumstances. That's a lot more subjective and I don't know what they would need for something like that. I would hope they need more than the cop's opinion.

There is actually no such thing as an off duty cop. They still have full power when they are off duty, just most don't give a shit. In my state, a city cop can issue tickets in any city that is in his host county. For example, a Dallas City cop can issue a ticket in any town that is in Dallas County, but he can't cross over to Kaufman county and issue a ticket.

Originally Posted by twilyth

If it's private property, then they can't issue a speeding violation unless his state somehow can impose state traffic laws on what people do on their own property. Maybe that's possible, but I would want to know what the legal basis for that is before I would believe it.

Not entirely, they can issue tickets for driving wrecklessly like doing a burnout in the mall parking lot. Same way they get you for cutting though a gas station to bypass a traffic light.

Now, where this gets interesting is that the cop/security guard can issue a ticket that is for the complex, provided you were informed that it's possible in your lease agreement. Much like a home owners association can issue fines and tickets for breaking the rules. I can't see much of a leg to stand on unless there is a speed limit posted.

[Reventon]

Originally Posted by DanTheBanjoman

Nah, it's called natural selection. Kids who cross streets without looking are removed from our evolutionary chain. It's how the lord designed it all.

Exactly, the retards die, the smart ones survive.

[Polaris573]

I had a conversation with my landlord to confirm the meeting today. When I asked her what laws and or Apartment complex rules regulate speed within the complex and what the speed limit was she was unable to give me an answer.

[Polaris573]

Originally Posted by JC316

Now, where this gets interesting is that the cop/security guard can issue a ticket that is for the complex, provided you were informed that it's possible in your lease agreement. Much like a home owners association can issue fines and tickets for breaking the rules. I can't see much of a leg to stand on unless there is a speed limit posted.

In Arkansas the owner only has to give express permission. I don't have to be notified. However, I assume permission would have to be given prior to writing the citation in which case a printed copy of the contract between the apartment complex and the little rock police would have to exist.

[yogurt_21]

Originally Posted by JC316

There is actually no such thing as an off duty cop. They still have full power when they are off duty, just most don't give a shit. In my state, a city cop can issue tickets in any city that is in his host county. For example, a Dallas City cop can issue a ticket in any town that is in Dallas County, but he can't cross over to Kaufman county and issue a ticket.




Not entirely, they can issue tickets for driving wrecklessly like doing a burnout in the mall parking lot. Same way they get you for cutting though a gas station to bypass a traffic light.

Now, where this gets interesting is that the cop/security guard can issue a ticket that is for the complex, provided you were informed that it's possible in your lease agreement. Much like a home owners association can issue fines and tickets for breaking the rules. I can't see much of a leg to stand on unless there is a speed limit posted.

might wanna check your laws again, city cops can't ticket outside of their city boundaries regardless of state. You must be confusing them with Sheriff's who can ticket anywhere in the county.

Now as for ticketing on private property most of those aren't directly traffic violations. Cutting through a gas station at a reasonable speed. cops can't do anything, the way you get ticketed is by speeding through them and endangering pedestrians walking back and forth to their cars from the shop. Same goes for speeding through parking lots.

@polaris due to it being private property you need to get aquanted with the words "reasonable and prudent" sometimes even 20 mph can be too fast if the corners are too tight or you're going by cars that are trying to back out. This is why most parking lots in AZ have 7mph speed limits. They are not often enforced, but an officer can determine you're endangering people by you going over them.

traffic violations on private property are always too hard for them to enforce so they find another method to get you. Typically it doesn't matter and it's best to just say "yes sir" and go about your day. Officers have egos and sometimes it's better to stoke it then trying to knock it down.

[Frick]

I'm just gonna go ahead and file this in my "America is very alien to me"-file.

[theJesus]

Originally Posted by Frick

I'm just gonna go ahead and file this in my "America is very alien to me"-file.

Don't worry, it's alien to me too, and I live here

[Polaris573]

Originally Posted by yogurt_21

might wanna check your laws again, city cops can't ticket outside of their city boundaries regardless of state. You must be confusing them with Sheriff's who can ticket anywhere in the county.

Now as for ticketing on private property most of those aren't directly traffic violations. Cutting through a gas station at a reasonable speed. cops can't do anything, the way you get ticketed is by speeding through them and endangering pedestrians walking back and forth to their cars from the shop. Same goes for speeding through parking lots.

@polaris due to it being private property you need to get aquanted with the words "reasonable and prudent" sometimes even 20 mph can be too fast if the corners are too tight or you're going by cars that are trying to back out. This is why most parking lots in AZ have 7mph speed limits. They are not often enforced, but an officer can determine you're endangering people by you going over them.

traffic violations on private property are always too hard for them to enforce so they find another method to get you. Typically it doesn't matter and it's best to just say "yes sir" and go about your day. Officers have egos and sometimes it's better to stoke it then trying to knock it down.

I think I am more upset by the way the situation was handled than the actual accusation of speeding. I think my speed was reasonable and prudent for conditions and even at 20 mph I routinely am tailgated by other occupants. Naturally the actions of other drivers do not excuse mine. However, if the manager and officer will specify a reasonable and prudent speed I will gladly take it under consideration.

[Polaris573]

Had a nice conversation with everybody this afternoon. I apologized for being short with the officer and he acknowledged that while I was going slightly faster than he preferred that I wasn't going excessively fast. He even admitted that in an experiment he also quickly hit 20 mph going down the same hill I was going down when not braking frequently and strongly.

[JC316]

Originally Posted by yogurt_21

might wanna check your laws again, city cops can't ticket outside of their city boundaries regardless of state. You must be confusing them with Sheriff's who can ticket anywhere in the county.

Nope, it's a new law in Texas. I confirmed it with 3 different officers. The have jurisdiction in all cities under their host county, just like the Sheriff's department.

[twilyth]

Originally Posted by JC316

Nope, it's a new law in Texas. I confirmed it with 3 different officers. The have jurisdiction in all cities under their host county, just like the Sheriff's department.

It depends on the state. For example, in NJ, Rutgers Campus police technically are only supposed to do enforcement on Rutgers Campuses, but they have state wide jurisdiction. Local cops don't. But that's in NJ.

Any citizen can swear out a complaint. If you see someone driving recklessly, you can go to the town where it happened and tell them you want to file a complaint for a traffic violation. The only difference is that here, you have to prosecute the complaint yourself.

My guess is that any off-duty cop will fall into the same category except that the town might elect to have the local prosecutor handle it.

These sorts of things vary state by state. I looked at the Arkansas statutes here on LexisNexis but couldn't find anything searching on "off-duty" or looking at section 27:49-54 (motor vehicular traffic).

[mlee49]

Originally Posted by Polaris573

Had a nice conversation with everybody this afternoon. I apologized for being short with the officer and he acknowledged that while I was going slightly faster than he preferred that I wasn't going excessively fast. He even admitted that in an experiment he also quickly hit 20 mph going down the same hill I was going down when not braking frequently and strongly.

Lame and anti-climatic. I was hoping for more or something like this

[theJesus]

Originally Posted by Polaris573

Had a nice conversation with everybody this afternoon. I apologized for being short with the officer and he acknowledged that while I was going slightly faster than he preferred that I wasn't going excessively fast. He even admitted that in an experiment he also quickly hit 20 mph going down the same hill I was going down when not braking frequently and strongly.

Well, glad to see that was resolved easily. Did you find out what the preferred speed is?